Homogenizers and Random Thoughts

How about this one…

I have recently discovered that 220 to 250 degrees Farenhieght is where I like to get it. The reason being; it works quite well. Just now I mixed some mango eliquid and the whole house smelled like mangos and cream. It smelled so good that I wanted to eat some mangos. With cream. Anywho, I think I’ll experiment some more with HEAT.

Honestly, I am anticipating some fallout over my statement. I almost feel sinful for doing it… :smiling_imp: :smiling_imp: :smiling_imp:

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Hehe, no fallout here @Dan_the_Man, but just questions. I’m wondering if that heated mix, potpourri’d your house up like that, all of those flavor molecules, will no longer be in your bottle, right ?

I think back to the debates long ago about uncapping steeping juice, and it was frowned upon, as it was allowing flavors to escape, and that was just at room temp we were worried about it. Now when heated, it would seem even MORE flavor molecules would be released, never to return back into your mix.

Sound reasoning, or ???

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image

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Well I don’t need to type anymore, that is word for word on my thoughts.

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https://www.jblearning.com/images/default-source/product-images/1449689175.jpg

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I’m not heating anything @Dan_the_Man, so we’ll have to work this out scientifically. Any flavors you smell, as you are mixing a juice are ESCAPING from your mix, that’s obvious. The more you smell in the air, the less that’s remaining in the bottle. Being in the “I don’t heat anything camp”, trying to determine how much MORE of the flavor(s) are escaping your mix, before it’s bottled, and capped.

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I recall some of those debates. And debate never seemed to include anyone with a degree in chemistry. Apart from that academic background, I think we’re only left with observation as a proof. Personally, I have tried several methods which include heat and did not find it to be of any benefit whatsoever. Once I thought it was helping because 8 hrs in a crockpot with water seemed to round off some flavors. What I later discovered is the heat was actually killing certain flavors. Recipes with nuances became more one dimensional. Of course this may have more to do with how hot and for how long they are heated. But still I never found any discernible value to heating my mixes and stopped the practice entirely. That is the reason for taking the temp measurements after using the homogenizer. I want to avoid unnecessary heat as much a possible.

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@SthrnMixer, great points. Although I don’t have a degree in chemistry, I DO have a degree in ribs. I stopped in at a well known (now out of business) Restaurant that pimped their world famous ribs. Hostesses, and servers, assaulted you with a big speech about them upon seating guests, guaranteed to love them or your money back. I found out they were PAR-boiling them, before cooking. WHAT ??? !!! They were bland, and terrible.

Had a friend who was par-boiling his too, and you could smell all the rib smell all over the room, and the water changed color, as IT too, was extracting flavor FROM the ribs. Needless to say, what goes OUT, never goes back IN.

It’s not to say that anyone who heats is going to have as bland of a juice, as those ribs were, but it DOES make one wonder about hasting the escape of flavor molecules, and the amount therein.

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Each to their own as far as heat goes it is an age old discussion. Mildly heating the VG to loosen it up is a whole lot different to heating the mix to a massive level.

Yes, if you heat the liquid excessively you will get a degradation of flavour however if you are talking 50-60c with just the VG then adding PG and flavours which will bring down the temp a far bit then I would absolutely challenge anyone who can pick the difference.

I think people are a little precious about their methods because they have found what works for them and they stick to it which is what mixing is all about - finding what works for you.

Blanket statements such as heat will kill a mix are IMHO in a similar boat as vape contains formaldehyde/heavy metals and like we all know the concentration matters (if present they are in such low quantity there is nothing to be concerned with) same with heat temperature matters if you heat it to 200c then sure it will have an effect a slight heat will have little or no discernible effect.

NOT A DOCTOR OR A CHEMIST

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Since I got the GC i jave been playing around a lot mixing 2 bottles of the same liquid etc , letting ine steep naturally with no heat and the other heating to 50c then adding PG and flavors …I can say that so far I cannot tell any difference …Ive done other test that include only SF like my precious MF flaves …Test that also include just a fruit flavor ( small volitiles) …This has been an interesting fun time in my mixing journey …I have to give @anon96069639 a shout out bc if he didnt introduce the GC im not sure many of us would be using any kind of Homogenizer weather uts the GC or another …

50 to 60c is all ive taken the temps to and since that what works there is no need imo to go any higher …

I AM A CHEMIST ( printing degree and changing the name of it while we speak ) shhhhh if it say i am then I am right ???

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My degree hope it is enough

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Being that heat is, by nature, a relative term, you can be truthful in saying heat will kill a mix. But I think it helps to quantify that statement. How much heat? I don’t know. The crock pot I was using on low would get the bottles too hot to hold, so well over 100F and probably closer to 200F. High setting takes water to a simmer on that little Rival dealio.

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I cant recall the exact temp but VG will start to degrade at i think around 75c (i will try and find the right temp) so I would say anything under that would be fine.

I should add i’m not trying to convert anyone :grin:

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Same here, unless people are putting their mixes in a pot on the stove. Then we gotta fix that shit :wink:

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I know there is a current study underway… how long it will take, well maybe a bit :slight_smile:

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It shouldn’t be hard to prove/disprove. I don’t have an electron microscope, or any way to compare at a molecular level the before and after. We need a chemist, or someone who does. Easy Peasy. Before, then heat, then After. Done.

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Hehe, I’ve heard of some pretty strange methods, hadn’t heard of “Stove’n It” yet. Ahhhh the things that the COVID lockdown have spwned !!!

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Does it matter?

If at the end of the day your recipe tastes good to you does it really matter how you got there?

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I don’t know but I doubt it.

Sounds plausible but I don’t know. When I cook the whole house is “potpourrie’d” as you say and I’m pretty sure that steak still tastes the same. I know it’s not the same but hey I use what I can.

I do have some of the same mix steeping and when it’s done I will compare. I could have done it before I posted but what fun would that have been?

I will also try it with a recipe I know well but the oneshot I mixed is very good and if there is flavor missing then it just might be overwhelming but I don’t think there is… I reckon I’ll find out.

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Opinion:

Anecdotal evidence reigns supreme regarding diy e-juice.

I make it for me and therefore am judge and jury. Heating is no different than choices of flavors or percentages of those flavors. I have found a process that works best for me. One size fits all is rarely applicable in my experience.

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It’s definitely an interesting thought - the correlation between flavor and aroma. The senses of taste and smell are so unique in that they are co-dependent. Regarding the flavors we use, do we have to assume that because you smell them that the flavor is in the air? I don’t know. I do like SDs flavor analogy with the par-boiling of ribs. Now that’s something I can wrap my head around, and he’s exactly right. Doing this cooks so much of the flavor out, where as allowing them to cook in their own juices seals flavor in so long as they don’t get overcooked. I just don’t know if it’s an accurate comparison or even something that translates to our hobby.

Indeed. And that’s what makes the experimentation process so fun and rewarding. Find what works for your tastes, and stick with it. At the same time, eliminate what doesn’t work. And the only way to do that is try lots of stuff.

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